12-11-2023, 20:03
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#736
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Trollsplatter
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul
What were they [supposedly] protesting about exactly ?
Also, what do they think the protest will actually achieve ?
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Israel has diplomatic cover from the United States, which despite its military and economic power is unable to operate entirely alone. Protests in European capitals pressurise European governments to moderate their support, which ultimately makes it more difficult for the USA to continue to support Israel. That’s the theory anyway, though any effects would be subtle and slow-acting.
But even if it had no perceivable diplomatic effect at all, what’s wrong with taking a moral stand? 300,000 people taking an active stand on an issue is surely healthy for a democracy.
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12-11-2023, 20:11
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#737
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The Dark Satanic Mills
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: floating in the ether
Posts: 12,072
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris
300,000 people taking an active stand on an issue is surely healthy for a democracy.
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It is, but if a very large % of those people are actually advocating for the eradication of a state and a people…..that’s when it becomes an issue.
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12-11-2023, 20:40
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#738
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,288
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
It is, but if a very large % of those people are actually advocating for the eradication of a state and a people…..that’s when it becomes an issue.
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Fortunately that's not the case with those marching for a ceasefire. May well be the case for those hard right people trying to reach the Cenotaph.
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12-11-2023, 20:49
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#739
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Architect of Ideas
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,475
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris
Israel has diplomatic cover from the United States, which despite its military and economic power is unable to operate entirely alone. Protests in European capitals pressurise European governments to moderate their support, which ultimately makes it more difficult for the USA to continue to support Israel. That’s the theory anyway, though any effects would be subtle and slow-acting.
But even if it had no perceivable diplomatic effect at all, what’s wrong with taking a moral stand? 300,000 people taking an active stand on an issue is surely healthy for a democracy.
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Very well put.
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12-11-2023, 21:00
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#740
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman
Koalemos?
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Confess I had to Google that particular god!
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12-11-2023, 22:10
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#741
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The Dark Satanic Mills
Join Date: Dec 2003
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1
Fortunately that's not the case with those marching for a ceasefire. May well be the case for those hard right people trying to reach the Cenotaph.
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Well then, All the protests were “hard right” if you like to phrase it that way.
Unless you think calling for the eradication of Jews is somehow Leftist progessionisn.
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12-11-2023, 22:14
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#742
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The Dark Satanic Mills
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Take a step back and look at we’re talking about.
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12-11-2023, 22:44
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#743
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cf.mega poster
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
Well then, All the protests were “hard right” if you like to phrase it that way.
Unless you think calling for the eradication of Jews is somehow Leftist progessionisn.
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Those calling for the eradication of any race tend to be a tiny minority of extremists. Doubtless a few in the ceasefire march but just that - a tiny minority.
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12-11-2023, 23:06
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#744
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laeva recumbens anguis
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
Take a step back and look at we’re talking about.
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You appear to be confusing Arabs and Palestinians - there are 465 million Arabs, and 5 million Palestinians
All Palestinians are Arabs - a small percentage of Arabs (slightly over 1%) are Palestinians…
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12-11-2023, 23:35
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#745
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The Dark Satanic Mills
Join Date: Dec 2003
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh
You appear to be confusing Arabs and Palestinians - there are 465 million Arabs, and 5 million Palestinians
All Palestinians are Arabs - a small percentage of Arabs (slightly over 1%) are Palestinians…
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And?
I’m loving watching the bullshit gymnastics on display.
---------- Post added at 23:35 ---------- Previous post was at 23:25 ----------
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1
Those calling for the eradication of any race tend to be a tiny minority of extremists. Doubtless a few in the ceasefire march but just that - a tiny minority.
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Hmmmn. Yes. It’s a minority.
I can’t count them all, but out of 300,000 marching and I would conservatively say that at any time 80% would be chanting “from the river to the sea”.
So as least there were 240,000 anti-Semitic/ pro Hamas there.
Not a “few”
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12-11-2023, 23:52
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#746
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Dec 2013
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
And?
I’m loving watching the bullshit gymnastics on display.
---------- Post added at 23:35 ---------- Previous post was at 23:25 ----------
Hmmmn. Yes. It’s a minority.
I can’t count them all, but out of 300,000 marching and I would conservatively say that at any time 80% would be chanting “from the river to the sea”.
So as least there were 240,000 anti-Semitic/ pro Hamas there.
Not a “few”
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I would say generously 0.5% were chanting that. Reality is likely less, a few hundred.
---------- Post added at 23:52 ---------- Previous post was at 23:51 ----------
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
Take a step back and look at we’re talking about.
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What's your point, caller?
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13-11-2023, 04:19
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#747
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Architect of Ideas
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,475
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
And?
I’m loving watching the bullshit gymnastics on display.
---------- Post added at 23:35 ---------- Previous post was at 23:25 ----------
Hmmmn. Yes. It’s a minority.
I can’t count them all, but out of 300,000 marching and I would conservatively say that at any time 80% would be chanting “from the river to the sea”.
So as least there were 240,000 anti-Semitic/ pro Hamas there.
Not a “few”
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The problem with such a broad definition of anti-Semitism it removes all meaning and devalues actual, genuine, claims of anti-Semitism.
While the sideshow debate of that chant goes on the poisonous, borderline genocidal, rhetoric of some Israeli ministers goes unnoticed and unchallenged here.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/pm-war...d-nuking-gaza/
It’s a bad day when Benjamin Netanyahu has to tell you to tone it down.
Last edited by jfman; 13-11-2023 at 04:25.
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13-11-2023, 07:44
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#748
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The Dark Satanic Mills
Join Date: Dec 2003
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1
I would say generously 0.5% were chanting that. Reality is likely less, a few hundred.
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I can’t respond to that in any serious way.
Quote:
What's your point, caller?
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It’s self evident
---------- Post added at 07:44 ---------- Previous post was at 07:37 ----------
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman
The problem with such a broad definition of anti-Semitism it removes all meaning and devalues actual, genuine, claims of anti-Semitism.
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The problem is very large groups of people shouting anti-Semitic chants is perfectly acceptable nowadays.
There’s no difference between those marching chanting, to people walking with white hoods in 60’s america.
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13-11-2023, 08:09
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#749
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Architect of Ideas
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,475
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
I can’t respond to that in any serious way.
It’s self evident
The problem is very large groups of people shouting anti-Semitic chants is perfectly acceptable nowadays.
There’s no difference between those marching chanting, to people walking with white hoods in 60’s america.
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I’d imagine 10,000 dead Palestinians would say otherwise had their voices not been wiped from the face of the earth.
If your own prejudices prevent you from perceiving the difference then that’s up to you.
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13-11-2023, 09:00
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#750
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laeva recumbens anguis
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Re: Hamas Israel War
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
And?
I’m loving watching the bullshit gymnastics on display.
---------- Post added at 23:35 ---------- Previous post was at 23:25 ----------
Hmmmn. Yes. It’s a minority.
I can’t count them all, but out of 300,000 marching and I would conservatively say that at any time 80% would be chanting “from the river to the sea”.
So as least there were 240,000 anti-Semitic/ pro Hamas there.
Not a “few”
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Yes, it’s called a mirror…
Most of Hamas support comes from Iran, a non-Arab country.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/w...-war-rbf38qng6
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