Eurozone will collapse...

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Derek

Because in government they still have some say rather than being the political irrelevance they normally are?

Errrmmmm, yep, that could be it!

Surely nobody expects politicians to be turkeys voting for Christmas.

[devilincarnate]

Originally Posted by Osem

Surely nobody expects politicians to be turkeys voting for Christmas.

This looks like ours politicians kissing babies?



So it could be

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Sirius

Well done Mr Cameron

Next lets have a Referendum and get to hell out of this Franco - German love in.

Funnily enough we would've had a referendum is if he'd signed it. I'm yet to be convinced of Dave's new found backbone, my default position with regard to politicians and Europe is that they're all bought and paid for with the prospect of joining the EU gravy train as a mp or commissioner.

Also the consequences of us not being able to do a deal or get just one country to support our position have yet to be established, I fear we could end up being alone in the tent with everyone else outside pishing in.

[denphone]

Originally Posted by devilincarnate

This looks like ours politicians kissing babies?



So it could be

Oh dear l feel sick.

[devilincarnate]

Originally Posted by denphone

Oh dear l feel sick.

I take it Turkey is off the worst time of the year for me then

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

Funnily enough we would've had a referendum is if he'd signed it. I'm yet to be convinced of Dave's new found backbone, my default position with regard to politicians and Europe is that they're all bought and paid for with the prospect of joining the EU gravy train as a mp or commissioner.

Also the consequences of us not being able to do a deal or get just one country to support our position have yet to be established, I fear we could end up being alone in the tent with everyone else outside pishing in.

you mean we may have join the rest of the world .It may be that us saying no may give other countries the courage to do the same and start putting some limits on the EU's power

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by martyh

you mean we may have join the rest of the world .It may be that us saying no may give other countries the courage to do the same and start putting some limits on the EU's power

The rest of the World that's already locked into trade blocks and agreements you mean, I wouldn't over estimate the World's desire to have us join in with them, the recent Central America sumit where the USA and Canada were not involved alone should tell you that.

[gba93]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

The rest of the World that's already locked into trade blocks and agreements you mean, I wouldn't over estimate the World's desire to have us join in with them, the recent Central America sumit where the USA and Canada were not involved alone should tell you that.

Perhaps we should join the North American Free Trade Association then ?

[Taf]

Nicolas Sarkozy, Angela Merkel and David Cameron stunned their European partners last night by announcing that France and Germany will abandon the euro and join the pound.

‘In hindsight combining both stable and weak economies to form the euro was a bad idea,’ conceded the German Chancellor. ‘It would be a bit like inviting a dozen people from the nearest sink estate to become joint holders on your bank account.’

To celebrate the monetary union the Royal Mint will introduce new banknotes which welcome Britain’s new European allies. ‘The new ten pound note will depict both Basil Fawlty goose-stepping and a goalmouth scene showing that Geoff Hurst’s second goal in 1966 never actually crossed the line, while the five pound note will show a monkey waving a white flag and eating cheese.’

George Osborne today confirmed that in honour of the present state of the British economy, the new extended area covered by the currency would be known as Poundland.

http://www.newsbiscuit.com/2011/12/1...oin-the-pound/

[Traduk]

Cameron had no choice but to take the action he took because of Merkel's insistence that a Tobin tax be applied to transactions passing through the City of London.

It could not have been outside of her knowledge that Sweden tried a unilateral imposition of a Tobin tax back in the 1980's and it was a total disaster which saw their domestic transactional business vanish abroad and with a reduced tax take through Capital Gains tax and almost none from the Tobin tax they had to stem the loss of tax by abandoning Tobin Tax.

It has been tried once on a unilateral basis and was a disaster. It would be again unless globally enforced and as we are unique within Europe as having a global exchange through which flows about a trillion a day in Forex trading, we were uniquely expected to kill our goose which lays the golden eggs.

I have a 100% belief that it would have destroyed the City of London as a major hub for financial transactions and with it would have gone a substantial number of the 1.3 million jobs in the finance area of the City and the 11% of the entire tax take to our exchequer,.

The Tobin tax is designed to curb and destroy speculative trading and can only be implemented if universal or it is a certainty that the business from which we reap so much will go elsewhere.

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/workin...7_en.htm#chap3

Cameron was made an offer he had to refuse and IMO it was a political manoeuvre to sideline the UK. If all the others including Germany added their collective bourses and exchanges together they are totally insignificant compared to London in the global world of trading so what others were not concerned about hardly affected them at all and in many cases not at all.

That ploy was to get us out and for no other purpose and now that mission is accomplished I would not be surprised if the Tobin tax as to be applied to Europe isn't a long time, maybe never in coming. Eurex trading futures on German indices has been a long term rival to Liffe (trading futures on UK indices) but even though the are minuscule compared the to Forex flow through London I cannot somehow see Germany killing off Eurex.

Amid the double dealing and back stabbing approach within European politics there is an element that I read about frequently over the past few months. European leaders appear to wish to ignore the fact that Europe is inherently a flawed concept and wish to apply the blame for their dilemma on the contagion of debt problems of which we via our banks and exchanges were a major player. They appear set on wreaking vengeance on the free market approach which in showing those fault lines within Europe is analogous to shooting the messenger but ignoring the message.

Nothing has been achieved towards the immediate resolution of Europe's problems beyond the desired political agenda which will please the core countries and we have been ostracised as was obviously desired.

Contrary to what the inner core of Europe think there is only one player in this farce who matters and judgement will be made and appropriate action taken. In the world of global finance we are as major a hub and in some areas more so than the USA. The direction is set on the other side of the Atlantic and from there will come the eventual judgement on Europe. In politics not a lot happens by accident and we may well one day be more than grateful that Cameron took one for team UK when the French poodle snubbed him.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Traduk

Cameron had no choice but to take the action he took because of Merkel's insistence that a Tobin tax be applied to transactions passing through the City of London.

...............Snip...............

What he said.

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

The rest of the World that's already locked into trade blocks and agreements you mean, I wouldn't over estimate the World's desire to have us join in with them, the recent Central America sumit where the USA and Canada were not involved alone should tell you that.

All the info i can find ,various blogs ,newspaper articles ect seem to suggest that our trade outside the EU is around 50% of our total trade .I did find this on the hmrc site

UK’s Non EU exports have increased by £1.3 billion (11.6
per cent) compared to September 2011, to £12.7 billion.
Compared to October 2010, exports have increased by
£2.1 billion (19.9 per cent).

•

UK’s Non EU imports have increased by £0.8 billion (4.7
per cent) compared to September 2011, to £17.9 billion.
Compared to October 2010 imports have increased by
£1.9 billion (11.9 per cent).

•

These monthly export and import figures are the highest
since the OTS was first published separately for non-EU
countries and EU Member States in 1993.

•

The UK remains a net importer (imports are greater than
exports), though the size of difference between imports
and exports has decreased compared to September 2011
by 9.0 per cent and has decreased from October 2010 by

3.8 per cent.

and this for EU trade

The value of UK trade increased in September 2011 after a fall in the previous month of August. The value of trade is also greater when compared to September 2010.
• UK’s EU exports have increased by £1.6 billion (13.4 per cent) compared to August 2011, to £13.6 billion. Compared to September 2010, exports have increased by £1.7 billion (14.8 per cent).
• UK’s EU imports have increased by £2.7 billion (17.1 per cent) compared to August 2011, to £18.4 billion. Compared to September 2010 imports have increased by £2.3 billion (14.6 per cent).
• The UK remains a net importer (imports are greater than exports). The size of difference between imports and exports has increased compared to August 2011 by 28.9 per cent and has increased from September 2010 by 14.2 per cent. This is the largest monthly difference during the period January 2008 to date although the July 2011 difference was close - £4.5 billion compared to the current value of £4.8 billion.

I realise that these figures are just a monthly snapshot but can't seem to find a year on graph for the 2 figures to compare

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by martyh

All the info i can find ,various blogs ,newspaper articles ect seem to suggest that our trade outside the EU is around 50% of our total trade .I did find this on the hmrc site

About 40%, figures are distorted somewhat by exports which stop in Europe on their way east.

[Mr Angry]