[Updated]U.S hold diplomatic Summit with North Korea

[Qtx]

Actually you are right about him doing it to protect himself. But also not having America invading your country is good for the people too. You know how indiscriminately they bomb innocent people.

While North Korea has some bad stories about what happens to some people there, the same could be said for a lot of other countries worse, including some African countries for example. Also plenty that are allies of the west. Remember we will happily sell bombs and weapons to the Saudie's and keep their questionable stuff out of the news. It's our governments view that Russia and North Korea be the bad guys now, as they have nowhere else to immediately attack to keep the military industrial complex money flowing.

But the point being North Korea is not going to invade other countries even though America has tried to starve the country through sanctions, constantly attacking the country in this way. China is North Koreas biggest trade partner and keeps them in food and fuel as well as criticising the sanctions and action against them, much in the same way an ally would.[COLOR="Silver"]

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Damien

Knew I should have got that Tesla.

There's still time

Originally Posted by Qtx

Actually you are right about him doing it to protect himself. But also not having America invading your country is good for the people too. You know how indiscriminately they bomb innocent people.

I doubt it's good for them. The good for them would be reunification of Korea but South Korea don't want this yet because of the economic strain it would cause due the health and education of the North Korean population.

While North Korea has some bad stories about what happens to some people there, the same could be said for a lot of other countries worse, including some African countries for example. Also plenty that are allies of the west. Remember we will happily sell bombs and weapons to the Saudie's and keep their questionable stuff out of the news. It's our governments view that Russia and North Korea be the bad guys now, as they have nowhere else to immediately attack to keep the military industrial complex money flowing.

Russia and North Korea are not synonymous here. Whilst they're both a problem for the West the former is at least a functioning country with a rational, if aggressive, government. These things do exist on a scale and North Korea are at the end of that.

Most of these other states are at least functioning and do not develop nuclear weapons and pose a existential threat to their neighbors. Iran might be the closest that springs to mind but they're still relatively functioning. North Korea is something special here. It's not just 'our governments view' that North Korea are the bad guys, they are to anyone that takes even a passing interest in them.

But the point being North Korea is not going to invade other countries even though America has tried to starve the country through sanctions, constantly attacking the country in this way. China is North Koreas biggest trade partner and keeps them in food and fuel as well as criticising the sanctions and action against them, much in the same way an ally would.[COLOR="Silver"]

America has not tried to 'starve' the country. That is the fault of the North Korean government. If it wasn't for America, South Korea and others in the 1990s then their famine would have been even worse. They stopped providing such assistance a few years ago but then started again last year. The country has been struggling since the collapse of the Soviet Union and their cash cow. They never developed any other economy or infrastructure, especially outside Pyongyang, and failed hard. The sanctions only hit the ruling classes as there is no developed wealth to lose outside of capital. China's interest is limited to stopping the place collapsing entirely and having a immigration and security crisis (and America) on their doorstep. They're not allies.

Trump tweeted this this morning.

"My first order as President was to renovate and modernize our nuclear arsenal. It is now far stronger and more powerful than ever before...."

How is it 'now far stronger and more powerful than before'? It takes years to renovate and modernise nuclear weapons, not six months.

No new Executive Orders or legislation has been signed/passed to make this happen. The only thing that has been done in this area was a Presidential Memorandum in January ordering a 30 day Readiness Review and a Nuclear Posture Review.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press...s-armed-forces

The Secretary shall initiate a new Nuclear Posture Review to ensure that the United States nuclear deterrent is modern, robust, flexible, resilient, ready, and appropriately tailored to deter 21st-century threats and reassure our allies.

The only DoD funding request that's gone to Congress this year (in March) was for $30 billion in additional funding, and the only think in that linked to the Nuclear Posture Review was this -

http://comptroller.defense.gov/Porta..._Amendment.pdf

Nuclear deterrence operations ($88.9 million) – Funds critical Nuclear Command, Control, and Communication capabilities to provide National Leadership secure connectivity, Nuclear Missile Sustainment and Security (parts to sustain the ICBM platform), and Nuclear Bomber Support (upgrades for strategic long range bombers).

Also, the US Military did not start the Nuclear Posture Review until April, and isn't due to deliver until at least October.

https://www.defensenews.com/space/20...t-to-look-for/

Timeline:

The Pentagon has pledged to finish the NPR by the "end of the year," according to the news release, but the conclusion could come more quickly. During an April 4 hearing in front of the Senate Armed Services Committee, Gen. John Hyten, the head of U.S. Strategic Command, said the administration had set a six-month timeline for the review.

[Qtx]

Trump is actually listening to his advisors a little bit now. They know that if he wants to say something, he will say it so they are giving him words to use that they think will be of benefit and told him that will make him better. Hence the "fire and fury" words he had to read from his notes.

North Korea is not a passive nation it has threatened every country near it bar Russia and China and has continued to develop it's ballistic missile program. China could have shut all this down long before now and we wouldn't be where we are now but they couldn't be bothered and just like the west underestimated NK. KJU doesn't care about the people of NK in the slightest he has continued the policies that do nothing but create hardship for his people enforced military service and a reliance on food imports to maintain a basic diet.

Both Russia and China are committing military forces to their respective borders with NK and it isn't to support NK as neither of them are prepared to take the losses both economically or in personnel that helping to defend NK would involve. Everyone ignored NK writing them off as that little state that's locked itself away from the world and never expecting them to be any real threat and even when they started down this road of missile development they were not taken seriously.

I would still put my money on surgical ground attacks to remove the threat rather then a more intense approach but i guess we will find out soon.

Originally Posted by Mr K

If a measure of his success is that he hasn't blown the World up yet, it's setting the bar a bit low imo.

Wrong as always but way to go for taking what I said out of context Mr K. Try the whole line next time.

[ntluser]

Kim Jong Un is just posturing for the "benefit" of his own people.

The danger we have to watch for is an over-reaction by Donald Trump, who likes to be seen to be taking action hence the self-promoting use of social media.

Obama would have been a lot cooler about this and would simply have made arrangements to shoot down any US-bound missile coming from North Korea.

Kim Jong Un is merely trying to get attention for himself. Trump reacts to him, Obama would make quiet preparations but publicly he would simply ignore him or make a calm low key response.

[pip08456]

You really think ignoring or making low key responses is the way to stop nuclear proliferation by dictators?

We are in this position because we have ignored NK not sure that's a practical strategy anymore.

[Osem]

Corbyn's right hand man Milne reckons that it's entirely logical for NK to have nuclear weapons, presumably because they're just the sort of deterrent they don't reckon Trident is...

Anyway if Trump is all talk then he won't be pressing any buttons any time soon so we're all ok....

[ntluser]

Originally Posted by pip08456

You really think ignoring or making low key responses is the way to stop nuclear proliferation by dictators?

At the moment, Kim Jong Un is just talking a good fight. We are at the sticks and stones stage. As long as the US has measures in place to shoot down any North Korean missiles there is no point getting worked up about it.

Talk is cheap. If Kim Jong Un launches the first missile he will be condemned by the world and the US will be within its rights to take him out as a danger to the world.Trump just has to stay calm and hold his nerve, confident that he has measures in place to protect the US against any missile attack.

---------- Post added at 12:11 ---------- Previous post was at 12:02 ----------

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

We are in this position because we have ignored NK not sure that's a practical strategy anymore.

We wouldn't be ignoring North Korea we would be ignoring Kim Jong Un. Trump will have measures in place to shoot down missiles sent from North Korea.

If Trump does not respond to Kim Jong Un, who is trying to wind him up with belligerent talk, Kim Jong Un will be forced either to shut up or to do something.

The moment hostile action is taken the US and the world will respond. The launching of any weapon against the US is an act of war and we all know how good the US is at producing shock and awe when it needs to.

Like all these things we'll just have to wait until events play out.

We do not have a 100% gauranteed missile defence system anywhere in the world so that one missile could do horrendous damage and cause millions of casualties. Israel's iron shield is perhaps the best tested system currently and that isn't close to 100%. If NK continues to use the sort of rhetoric they are and then do something stupid the people will not be happy with a leader that say's "we were confident in our defences" and NK is talking specifics now in relation to a multi missile attack on Guam. If Russia or China were on the end of this type of rhetoric they wouldn't be listening to calls for calm and reason.

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by ntluser

The moment hostile action is taken the US and the world will respond. The launching of any weapon against the US is an act of war and we all know how good the US is at producing shock and awe when it needs to.

Like all these things we'll just have to wait until events play out.

Should be good.

we need to keep our gob shut though. we're just a dot on the map. we always forget that when it comes to playing in charge.

[Uncle Peter]

Any ballistic missile attack heading for US territory will almost certainly result in a strategic nuclear response resulting in the destruction of the North Korean state as we know it. Interception of their missiles will merely be a footnote.

I think this is the point Trump is trying to make in a roundabout way.