VOD : Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by jfman

A darned sight

Old Boy it's you who have made absolutely definitive statements in ignorance of the evidence and, as I've pointed out on many occasions, the extreme difficulties in moving consumer behaviour in such a drastic manner without state intervention.

I've described a fairly accurate future in the past - customers will continue to enjoy a diverse range of content over IP and traditional broadcast, on demand and linear. I don't see huge amounts of people running to disagree me, I just see you moving the goalposts, over and over spinning the words of others in a desperate attempts to give yourself any credibility at all.



Old Boy if this is going to be another Saturday night where you are going to contradict yourself I'm tired of the contortions of your argument. In one paragraph linear is dead, in the next plucky upstarts Pluto TV will do what Sky (and others) can't - maintain a linear presence while moving 75, 80, 90+ per cent of their business to streaming.

Honestly, jfman, listen to yourself! You have set the bar so high, that even if one linear channel remains in 15 years, you will claim that you have won the argument! I don’t think that many on here, even your supporters, would agree with that.

I have given plenty of links to support my claims, and you have given us only your opinions. I am not contradicting myself at all, no matter how many times you say it. The existing conventional scheduled TV channels will cease to exist. That is the thrust of my argument, and you continue to try to muddy the waters with technical definitions of what constitutes a linear channel, etc.

I have tried really hard to put across what I believe will be the future of TV, and you are still so wrapped up in disbelief, you try to throw all this ‘technical’ confusion around just to be argumentative. We all see through you, old chap, and trying to diss me by attempting to have people believe that I am changing my position on this does you no credit. My position remains the same, no matter how you try to confuse issues.

So, play with your channel numbers as much as you like, and make the most of it. The future is the internet. You heard it here first...

[jfman]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Honestly, jfman, listen to yourself! You have set the bar so high, that even if one linear channel remains in 15 years, you will claim that you have won the argument! I don’t think that many on here, even your supporters, would agree with that.

Old Boy you can't have the end of linear television if there's even one channel. It is only you who has spoken in such absolute terms for years. Everyone accepts there will be less linear channels as more people move to streaming and internet based services. The two parts open to dispute are the extent and the timeline.

I have given plenty of links to support my claims, and you have given us only your opinions. I am not contradicting myself at all, no matter how many times you say it. The existing conventional scheduled TV channels will cease to exist. That is the thrust of my argument, and you continue to try to muddy the waters with technical definitions of what constitutes a linear channel, etc.

You'll find every one of those links is just an opinion!

I have tried really hard to put across what I believe will be the future of TV, and you are still so wrapped up in disbelief, you try to throw all this ‘technical’ confusion around just to be argumentative. We all see through you, old chap, and trying to diss me by attempting to have people believe that I am changing my position on this does you no credit. My position remains the same, no matter how you try to confuse issues.

So, play with your channel numbers as much as you like, and make the most of it. The future is the internet. You heard it here first...

As I've pointed out on many occasions I have 4 different streaming services. So there's no need to personalise this to my TV viewing habits. I'm happy to acknowledge I'm not representative of the average television viewer.

Old Boy far from being 'technical confusion' it's key to your argument. You conflate linear television and IPTV, scheduled television and on demand to obfuscate your point so often I genuinely believe it can only be deliberate and not the result of innocent confusion.

What distinguishes these "Pluto TV" type services from say, the viewing experience someone has using "TV from Sky" on a Playstation? Is someone watching "TV from Sky" on a Playstation, watching Sky Sports Main Event for example, watching 'linear television' in your scenario?

I've asked you for straightforward yes or no answers to broadly equivalent questions on numerous occasions and you evade and obfuscate.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by jfman

Old Boy you can't have the end of linear television if there's even one channel. It is only you who has spoken in such absolute terms for years. Everyone accepts there will be less linear channels as more people move to streaming and internet based services. The two parts open to dispute are the extent and the timeline.



You'll find every one of those links is just an opinion!



As I've pointed out on many occasions I have 4 different streaming services. So there's no need to personalise this to my TV viewing habits. I'm happy to acknowledge I'm not representative of the average television viewer.

Old Boy far from being 'technical confusion' it's key to your argument. You conflate linear television and IPTV, scheduled television and on demand to obfuscate your point so often I genuinely believe it can only be deliberate and not the result of innocent confusion.

What distinguishes these "Pluto TV" type services from say, the viewing experience someone has using "TV from Sky" on a Playstation? Is someone watching "TV from Sky" on a Playstation, watching Sky Sports Main Event for example, watching 'linear television' in your scenario?

I've asked you for straightforward yes or no answers to broadly equivalent questions on numerous occasions and you evade and obfuscate.

Well, jfman, I think you are the master of obfuscation! I am using everyday language, and if you find that difficult to compute, that’s your problem.

You may deride the links I provide, but the fact remains that your responses are your own opinions, unsupportive of any links at all.

I am not sure which yes/no answers you are referring to. Perhaps you should remind us. I have always tried my best to answer questions posed on here, even those posed with malice.

As for conflating linear channels with IPTV, you are the confused one here. I have consistently said that the existing broadcast scheduled TV channels will be replaced by IPTV, and that it will no longer make sense to present channels as ‘BBC1, BBC2’ and ‘ITV1, ITV2’ etc. Programmes will be categorised instead. That is all. Yes, it’s just TV, but TV will be presented differently.

I have acknowledged that there may be some minority IPTV channels as they exist on Pluto, and if you think that justifies your argument, so be it. I have never denied that these may exist in the future. However, the main broadcasters will not look at that as any kind of solution.

You may have four streaming services, and well done you. But that argument does not make the comments you have made any more relevant.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

As for conflating linear channels with IPTV, you are the confused one here. I have consistently said that the existing broadcast scheduled TV channels will be replaced by IPTV, and that it will no longer make sense to present channels as ‘BBC1, BBC2’ and ‘ITV1, ITV2’ etc. Programmes will be categorised instead. That is all. Yes, it’s just TV, but TV will be presented differently.

I have acknowledged that there may be some minority IPTV channels as they exist on Pluto, and if you think that justifies your argument, so be it. I have never denied that these may exist in the future. However, the main broadcasters will not look at that as any kind of solution.

You may have four streaming services, and well done you. But that argument does not make the comments you have made any more relevant.

I'm still at a loss here Old Boy - are these linear scheduled channels in the conventional sense and if so why will it work for minority interest channels and not the biggest names in the business and the state broadcaster?

On the contrary OB my having 4 streaming services demolishes your attempts to present my television preferences as outdated. I'm not talking about me - I'm talking about the television market as a whole.

I think it's easier rather than conflate your comments and throw in minority interest platforms that have 4 users like Pluto TV to answer questions as I present them with reference to popularly used products in the marketplace.

If someone was casting BT Sport 1 from the iOS app to a Chromecast would you describe them as watching linear television? Would they be streaming? Would they be both?

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Lifetime is the latest channel to bite the dust.

https://www.mediamole.co.uk/entertai...nd_434970.html


Lifetime will close down in the UK, Ireland and Malta on February 28, we can confirm.

They have been forced by sheer economics to admit that the future is the internet, not DTT broadcasting. I am sure that all forward looking forum members will see the wisdom of that assessment. I, however, could not possibly comment.

To the best of my knowledge, Lifetime isn't going onto the internet or on-demand, it's going full stop. It looks to have been more a victim of a Comcast-owned Sky not wanting to duplicate Comcast's Hayu service. (Lifetime UK being co-owned by Sky and Hearst)

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

To the best of my knowledge, Lifetime isn't going onto the internet or on-demand, it's going full stop. It looks to have been more a victim of a Comcast-owned Sky not wanting to duplicate Comcast's Hayu service. (Lifetime UK being co-owned by Sky and Hearst)

Yes, and because it no longer makes financial sense. That’s my point.

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Yes, and because it no longer makes financial sense. That’s my point.

In which case you’ve shifted the goalposts - again.

Businesses ending a service because they’ve made acquisitions and have an opportunity to avoid duplication has been going on since forever. It never makes financial sense for one company to do the same thing twice over. That says nothing whatsoever about the viability of the service itself. You might have noticed that the channel owner isn’t getting out of broadcast tv. They’re just ending a product line.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by jfman

I'm still at a loss here Old Boy - are these linear scheduled channels in the conventional sense and if so why will it work for minority interest channels and not the biggest names in the business and the state broadcaster?

On the contrary OB my having 4 streaming services demolishes your attempts to present my television preferences as outdated. I'm not talking about me - I'm talking about the television market as a whole.

I think it's easier rather than conflate your comments and throw in minority interest platforms that have 4 users like Pluto TV to answer questions as I present them with reference to popularly used products in the marketplace.

If someone was casting BT Sport 1 from the iOS app to a Chromecast would you describe them as watching linear television? Would they be streaming? Would they be both?

What is your point? Does it relate in any way to what I have said, and if so, how?

Stop being obtuse and say what you mean. Any genuine questions I will answer. But stop beating around the bush.

I’m done with trying to make sense of your outbursts. You need to explain yourself cogently, so we can all understand the points you are making.

[jfman]

Question: If someone was casting BT Sport 1 from the iOS app to a Chromecast would you describe them as watching linear television? Would they be streaming? Would they be both?

I await your reply.

---------- Post added at 23:58 ---------- Previous post was at 23:56 ----------

Originally Posted by Chris

In which case you’ve shifted the goalposts - again.

Heaven forbid.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Chris

In which case you’ve shifted the goalposts - again.

Businesses ending a service because they’ve made acquisitions and have an opportunity to avoid duplication has been going on since forever. It never makes financial sense for one company to do the same thing twice over. That says nothing whatsoever about the viability of the service itself. You might have noticed that the channel owner isn’t getting out of broadcast tv. They’re just ending a product line.

Well, yes. But the fact remains that another channel has deactivated because on financial grounds it doesn’t make sense to continue to broadcast it. Despite the fact that, according to jfman, it only costs buttons to run a TV channel.

As streamers gain ascendency, you will see more channels go to the wall. It’s all finance driven, one way or the other. Watch and learn.

---------- Post added at 00:05 ---------- Previous post was at 00:04 ----------

Originally Posted by jfman

Question: If someone was casting BT Sport 1 from the iOS app to a Chromecast would you describe them as watching linear television? Would they be streaming? Would they be both?

I await your reply.[COLOR="Silver"]

-

Er, who cares? This has nothing to do with my argument, at all!

[jfman]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Well, yes. But the fact remains that another channel has deactivated because on financial grounds it doesn’t make sense to continue to broadcast it. Despite the fact that, according to jfman, it only costs buttons to run a TV channel.

As streamers gain ascendency, you will see more channels go to the wall. It’s all finance driven, one way or the other. Watch and learn.

For someone who refuses to answer direct questions it’s funny that you misrepresent others when they clearly define technical aspects of their argument.

Nowhere, anywhere, do i state the above in the manner or with the intent you portray above.

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Well, yes. But the fact remains that another channel has deactivated because on financial grounds it doesn’t make sense to continue to broadcast it. Despite the fact that, according to jfman, it only costs buttons to run a TV channel.

When Orange and T-Mobile merged to form EE, the combined company deactivated hundreds of base stations it no longer needed because they were duplicating effort.

By your bizarre logic this would be proof of the coming demise of mobile phones.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Er, who cares? This has nothing to do with my argument, at all!

The rest of us care because you purposely refuse to clearly define concepts that you use almost interchangeably.

This allows you to shift the goalposts, essentially “winning” the argument if one of two set but very different scenarios happen:

a) linear channels cease broadcast over cable, satellite and DTT, but continue over IPTV
b) linear channels cease completely.

One of those is infinitely more likely than the other, but probably still not within your timeframe. I’m asking you to tell us which of the two you mean and stick to it. An answer a) or b) uncaveated would be useful at this point.

Which we know you won’t do.

If you have difficulty understanding either, or the difference, then you’re probably not the best informed person to be making the argument you are and it’d go some way to explaining how we got here after six long years.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by jfman

For someone who refuses to answer direct questions it’s funny that you misrepresent others when they clearly define technical aspects of their argument.

Nowhere, anywhere, do i state the above in the manner or with the intent you portray above.

Ok, present your direct questions, then. Presumably these direct questions will relate in a direct way to my direct arguments.

I have not refused anything! Are you hallucinating or just misunderstanding? I am seriously not understanding where you are coming from!

---------- Post added at 00:23 ---------- Previous post was at 00:21 ----------

Originally Posted by Chris

When Orange and T-Mobile merged to form EE, the combined company deactivated hundreds of base stations it no longer needed because they were duplicating effort.

By your bizarre logic this would be proof of the coming demise of mobile phones.

No, it proves that these decisions are motivated by financial considerations. I have not argued anything else.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Ok, present your direct questions, then. Presumably these direct questions will relate in a direct way to my direct arguments.

I have not refused anything! Are you hallucinating or just misunderstanding? I am seriously not understanding where you are coming from!

---------- Post added at 00:23 ---------- Previous post was at 00:21 ----------



No, it proves that these decisions are motivated by financial considerations. I have not argued anything else.

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/show...postcount=1659

Still waiting for an answer other than “who cares”.

I’m calling it a night for tonight as last time you spun it out to 4am with no clear answers and the mods weren’t happy,

I’ve asked clear questions and explained my rationale for doing so.