Unstoppable migration?

[figgyburn]

Well done hungary.These people showed their true colours by rioting when they did not get their way.Plenty of police injuries caused by these imposters.Barbarians at the gates indeed.

[heero_yuy]

If only a fraction of a percent of these "refugees" are ISIS then there are already hundreds of mad Jihadi's loose on the continent and no doubt soon to arrive here if not already and we're sodding about with drones over Syria?

[Ignitionnet]

Oh dear.

Hungary building a fence to close off border with Croatia at some points, and another along their border with Romania, to go alongside the fence between them and Serbia.

Slovenia to establish 'temporary' border controls between themselves and Hungary.

Austria have stepped up border checks.

Bulgaria have sent troops to their Turkish border.

This all has an air of inevitability about it.

[Osem]

To what extent there is terrorist infiltration within the ranks of the migrants is never going to be known and that is a big problem. Given how much effort we make to screen people coming in via the traditional routes, I find it bizarre that so many unknown people can just be allowed in on the simple untested basis that they're refugees. That, however, has been the case for years so it's nothing new but it does demonstrate the shambolic nature of the EU's approach to security.

What's equally worrying and just as obvious is the way in which some of the migrants choose to behave when they don't get their way. Make no mistake I have great sympathy for the plight of the genuine but amongst them there are all sorts of people ranging from economic migrants to people with extremely dubious histories who we could well do without. We have to do what we can to separate these from the genuine refugees who need our help, albeit IMHO, help closer to home because we can't take them all in and must be diligent in removing those who have no right to entry. The EU has been a soft touch and more recently the bizarre actions of Germany in particular are responsible for drawing economic migrants into the EU and only now do they appear to be regretting what they've done.

I think any policy which allows large numbers of primarily young men into the EU from many countries around the globe is very dangerous. We have experience in London of young men from various nations who've been allowed to come here and then been left to get on with it with little support or hope. Consequently a good number have failed to find jobs and found themselves involved in crime and gangs, often in conflict with rival migrant groups ironically. Do we really need more crime and gangs when the activities of our indigenous population already stretches the legal and law enforcement services in particular? Do we really need more social unrest added to that we already suffer?

What's being seen in Hungary and in Calais is what happens when large numbers of young men are allowed to do what they want in order to get what they want. Try to turn them back and they eventually use even more force and/or take even more extreme measures to get what they want. It's clear they're not interested in compromise, they want to go to Germany or they want to come to the UK because they believe that's what's best for them. No amount of reasoning from EU cloud cuckoo land HQ about spreading the burden will change that and persuade such people to go quietly to/settle in places they don't want to be.

We are now seeing the consequences of raising false hopes and once people have become desperate, for whatever reason, trying to control what they do and where they go becomes a massive problem. IMHO we need to shut the gates and send that message out loud and clear. We need to focus our efforts and aid much closer to the problem areas and convince those on the move that our help will be provided in that way and nothing will be gained by traipsing across Europe trying to get in. Part of the message needs to be robust enforcement and the removal of those found to be illegal. We need to do much more to prove to would be economic migrants that they will not be allowed to bully their way into Europe and then be able to exploit the system to remain.

None of this is going to be easy and it will require some unpleasant choices to be made but that's the stark reality IMHO because if we continue on this chaotic path all that's going to happen is the problem will grow ever more serious. Whilst we're preoccupied with trying to keep out/remove vast numbers of economic migrants and other illegals, we're not going to be so able to help the genuine refugees to stay safe whilst they await the time when they can go back home and let's make no mistake, that should be the ultimate aim. We cannot accept all the world's needy and vulnerable and the only real question is at what point do we have to say enough is enough? If we fail to grasp the nettle all that will happen is our own way of life will increasingly suffer and we'll gradually see growing social unrest as an inevitable consequence.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

Oh dear.

Hungary building a fence to close off border with Croatia at some points, and another along their border with Romania, to go alongside the fence between them and Serbia.

Slovenia to establish 'temporary' border controls between themselves and Hungary.

Austria have stepped up border checks.

Bulgaria have sent troops to their Turkish border.

This all has an air of inevitability about it.

Common currency, common borders, common asylum policy ... The EU works really well, until it doesn't.

[Ramrod]

Originally Posted by Osem

To what extent there is terrorist infiltration within the ranks of the migrants is never going to be known and that is a big problem. <snip>

Excellent post!

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Chris

Common currency, common borders, common asylum policy ... The EU works really well, until it doesn't.

Add that the refusal of the Eurocrats to accept they might be wrong their ideas flawed and a rapid change of policy required. They're like highly paid lemmings really, 'secure' in their combined blindness of reality as they head towards the edge of the precipice. Frankly, I wouldn't give a toss about their fate if ours weren't so closely bound to theirs. These faceless suits are in denial about what is a massive issue and all the time they have yet more meetings about meetings the pressure is growing. I fear something big is going to give and have no doubt they'll still be in denial after it all kicks off.

I'd like to be able to say we're victims of the law of unintended consequences but IMHO fatally flawed EU policy, structure and decision making has made this and other crises like it inevitable.

[Ignitionnet]

How's inviting them to come through working out for you, Croatia?

Seemed a good idea at the time I guess.

The above story has been updated since I copy/pasted the link.

Crowds of migrants crossing from Serbia have broken through riot police lines on the Croatian border at Tovarnik.

Croatian officials say migrants must apply for asylum there or be treated as illegal immigrants.

Groups of people broke through police lines, with women and children knocked over in the melee.

In the baking heat, crowds of migrants chanted "we want to go".

Correspondents say police are helping children and other vulnerable people to get through.

From Twitter:

Croatia Interior Minister tells @Channel4News "We are absolutely full." He's told UNHCR 'it's your problem'

Also:

https://twitter.com/Channel4News/sta...14250824679424

https://twitter.com/millerC4/status/644516880405917696

The moment the crowd broke thru Croatian police lines. They'd begun to bus them out. Patience snapped

Sounds like Croatia is doing the best it can, and it's apparently not good enough for the refugees / migrants.

[Osem]

Crowds of migrants have scuffled with Croatian police in at least two places along the border with Serbia as they seek to enter the European Union.

They briefly broke through police lines at Tovarnik and Bezdan after hours waiting in full sun.

At least 8,900 migrants entered Croatia on Thursday, officials said, after Hungary closed its border, blocking the previous land route into the EU.

Croatia's interior minister says the country is "absolutely full".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34283152

I think his country will soon be a lot fuller.

[Osem]

Croatia has closed seven of its eight road border crossings with Serbia following a huge influx of migrants.

Officials said they had no choice after more than 11,000 people entered the country since Hungary fenced off its border with Serbia earlier this week.

Some told the BBC they plan to walk north to neighbouring Slovenia which is in the EU's border-free Schengen Area.

Huge numbers of people heading north from the Mediterranean have created a political crisis in the European Union.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34286432

It seems few of these people want to be fingerprinted and registered anywhere other than where they choose. Quite frankly that cannot be allowed to continue.
Wasn't long ago that the Prime Minister of Croatia was as welcoming as Bob Geldof...

[heero_yuy]

Croatia's interior minister says the country is "absolutely full".

Full?!? He wants to come and take a look at the UK to see what full feels like.

[Osem]

Given what happened to Germany as a result of Merkel's ill judged invitation, it does make you wonder what the Croatian PM was thinking when he offered to help migrants on their way.

[nomadking]

Croatia full? They kicked out over 250,000 Serbs. Must be empty homes there.

[Osem]

Migrants flooding into Croatia will be "moved on", PM Zoran Milanovic has warned, adding that his country cannot become a "migrant hotspot".

He said the country's borders would not be shut completely, but it had reached its limit.

His remarks came as Croatia closed seven of eight road crossings after a huge influx of migrants seeking onward passage towards northern Europe.

More than 14,000 have entered Croatia, with tensions high and many exhausted.

Huge numbers heading north through the Balkans have triggered an EU crisis.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34291648

I can't see anyone else wanting to accept them for very long if at all, so how does he propose to move them on?

What we have now is an increasingly frustrated, angry and desperate mass of people being passed from pillar to post and sooner or later I believe things will erupt into serious violence.

[techguyone]

Seems like they're *choosing* to be passed around as they don't seem keen to be processed at these particular Countries. Not good enough for them? Makes them seem less like 'refugees' more like hedging their bets. It won't be long until the initial 'hug a refugee' from the handwringers will evaporate.