23-11-2017, 15:44
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#16
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Sad Doig Fan!
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taf
Mid to late 80's . Parascending was the first target, then other "extreme" sports including mountain biking, motocross, etc. "Mainline" sports such as rugby, football, tennis, etc., were not included at that time, but players were warned that being unfit for duty as a result of sport could cause them problems.
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In other words sports not supported and classed as "extra curricular". therefore "At your own risk".
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23-11-2017, 16:54
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#17
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 10,054
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by pip08456
Possibly because "hardened smokers" don't buy from shops any more due to the price. This benefits organised crime in China, Russia etc.
Price goes up, less duty raised no decrease in the number of smokers. Good strategy by ASH and the anti smoking lobbying.
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True, most smokers that I know now use the black market because of the cost. ISTR reading somewhere that about 50% of smokers now do this.
My opinion on smoking is that, as long as adults are fully aware of the health risks and other people aren't affected, they have a right to do so.
I argued against a unilateral smoking ban in pubs. Smoking rooms with a warning on the door or smoking & smoke free pubs at the discretion of the licence holder would have been a better idea.
Also, I believe that other taxpayers shouldn't bear the cost of others smoking and they don't. Only about 20% of taxation on tabacco is needed to compensate the NHS, the rest is pure profit for the treasury.
If everyone stopped smoking tomorrow, the Government would face a financial hole in its finances and could mean an increase in income tax for the rest of us.
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23-11-2017, 19:02
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#18
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Sad Doig Fan!
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardCoulter
True, most smokers that I know now use the black market because of the cost. ISTR reading somewhere that about 50% of smokers now do this.
My opinion on smoking is that, as long as adults are fully aware of the health risks and other people aren't affected, they have a right to do so.
I argued against a unilateral smoking ban in pubs. Smoking rooms with a warning on the door or smoking & smoke free pubs at the discretion of the licence holder would have been a better idea.
Also, I believe that other taxpayers shouldn't bear the cost of others smoking and they don't. Only about 20% of taxation on tabacco is needed to compensate the NHS, the rest is pure profit for the treasury.
If everyone stopped smoking tomorrow, the Government would face a financial hole in its finances and could mean an increase in income tax for the rest of us.
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BLOODY HELL Richard! I never thought this day would ever come. I actually agree with you 100%!
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23-11-2017, 19:43
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#19
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Haggis Hunting
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Over there
Posts: 1,096
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
I doubt very much that "50% of smokers" use the black market. Maybe in an anecdotal bubble.
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23-11-2017, 19:49
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#20
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Still alive and fighting
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kabaal
I doubt very much that "50% of smokers" use the black market. Maybe in an anecdotal bubble.
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More like a few per cent l would say now.
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“The only lesson you can learn from history is that it repeats itself”
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23-11-2017, 19:50
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#21
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Sad Doig Fan!
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kabaal
I doubt very much that "50% of smokers" use the black market. Maybe in an anecdotal bubble.
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Perhaps but it is a sizeable percentage, then again anecdotally I travel far and wide throughout the country and the black market exists and is thriving. As the government increase prices so does the black market.
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23-11-2017, 19:58
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#22
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cf.mega poster
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
June 2017 Link
Quote:
Code-named Operation Henry II, it resulted in the seizure of 2.9 million cigarettes and 1,272kg of tobacco worth £919,000.
A total of 409 premises were targeted, mainly small food outlets with alcohol licences, with illegal tobacco found in 172 of them – that’s 42%. More than half of them were previous offenders.
Around £2.1billion is lost in tax to the illegal tobacco trade each year.
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Apparently counterfeit and contraband consumption was 16% just 2 years ago.
IMO licensing of sales of alcohol and tobacco should be linked. Transgress on one and you lose the license to sell the other.
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23-11-2017, 19:59
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#23
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Haggis Hunting
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Over there
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by pip08456
Perhaps but it is a sizeable percentage, then again anecdotally I travel far and wide throughout the country and the black market exists and is thriving. As the government increase prices so does the black market.
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I'm not sure how you travelling "far and wide" backs it up.
Of course more and more people will look to other means as prices rise but saying things like 50% of the country use the black market for fags is nonsense.
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23-11-2017, 23:09
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#24
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Jul 2004
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
My wife and I don't smoke shop bought cigs anymore, but if we did we would definitely be looking at the cheaper black market stuff.
We now both roll our own, and although it took some getting used to it's much cheaper than anything else out there.
And I'd estimate that 50% of smokers buying from the black market is a pretty close ball park figure. Trying to force a stop on something like this simply drives it underground.
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23-11-2017, 23:48
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#25
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Sad Doig Fan!
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kabaal
I'm not sure how you travelling "far and wide" backs it up.
Of course more and more people will look to other means as prices rise but saying things like 50% of the country use the black market for fags is nonsense.
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As a smoker myself I think I have a little more knowledge about black market tobacco products than a non-smoker.
Also worthy of note, I never mentioned Fags or 50%.
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24-11-2017, 00:28
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#26
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Haggis Hunting
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Over there
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by pip08456
As a smoker myself I think I have a little more knowledge about black market tobacco products than a non-smoker.
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A little more knowledge than who? I myself was a smoker for 20+ years until a couple of years ago, does that also give me some magical insight into the buying habits of a 66 million population country?
Quote:
Also worthy of note, I never mentioned Fags or 50%.
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No but you quoted my answer to someone that did.
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24-11-2017, 10:43
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#27
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Grumpy Fecker
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kabaal
I doubt very much that "50% of smokers" use the black market. Maybe in an anecdotal bubble.
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Well I do for starters, I have a friend who travels to Europe most weeks in a large lorry.
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24-11-2017, 12:07
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#28
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laeva recumbens anguis
Cable Forum Team
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sirius
Well I do for starters, I have a friend who travels to Europe most weeks in a large lorry.
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Wow!
Tax evasion...
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24-11-2017, 12:14
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#29
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Sad Doig Fan!
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sirius
Well I do for starters, I have a friend who travels to Europe most weeks in a large lorry.
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Likewise and if away in another part of the country I can always find a source.
As I'm not a nonsmoker what do I know.
As a smoker I do know that the black market tobacco is readily available anywhere I go.
Ex smokers quite often come across worse than born again Christians! They know everything!
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24-11-2017, 12:28
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#30
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Still alive and fighting
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Re: Minimum Tobacco Pricing
Quote:
Originally Posted by pip08456
Likewise and if away in another part of the country I can always find a source.
As I'm not a nonsmoker what do I know.
As a smoker I do know that the black market tobacco is readily available anywhere I go.
Ex smokers quite often come across worse than born again Christians! They know everything!
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Well you are alright with me then as l had one try behind the bike shed at school and praise the lord that was quite enough for me thank you.
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