Unstoppable migration?

[mrmistoffelees]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

Immigrants and benefits

Since illegals are not entitled to much in the way of benefits I wonder where all the stories abut them getting money, houses, etc are coming from? Can't just be the right wing press following an agenda?

Sssh lets not facts get in the way of the arguement

---------- Post added at 13:13 ---------- Previous post was at 12:50 ----------

Has anyone mentioned the huge problems the Italians are facing at the moment?

[nomadking]

Well there must be a benefit of some kind in coming here or else why bother with all the hassle and just remain in France or wherever.

As a mere UK citizen with a family line officially traced back over 900 years in this country, I wouldn't mind having the right to be housed.

2. What you'll get
You can ask for somewhere to live, a cash allowance or both as an asylum seeker.
Housing
You’ll be given somewhere to live if you need it. This could be in a flat, house, hostel or bed and breakfast.

Originally Posted by nomadking

As a mere UK citizen with a family line officially traced back over 900 years in this country, I wouldn't mind having the right to be housed.

900 years? You sound suspiciously like a Norman settler to me. Get back where you came from, you flaming immigrant.

[Osem]

The problem is as much one of expectation (possible false or naïve) and experience. Having come so far these people are not going to want to accept that actually things here aren't as good as they think. Having said that the Beeb was interviewing migrants in Calais today and one of them said that he wanted to come here because he knew he'd be given housing like his friends had. I can fully understand why they'd choose to believe the best because accepting the worst would leave them in a very bad place, with no hope of the life they'd decided to pursue.

Has anyone mentioned the problems the Italians are having? Yes several times, including the very first post in this thread. The Greeks and the Hungarians too. The fact that they're having worse problems is all the more reason for us to act, I'd have thought or will some people only feel better when the numbers arriving here in lorries and boats equal those elsewhere?

[mrmistoffelees]

OK, an open question, how do 'we' act?

What is it exactly that people want to be done?

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by Chris

900 years? You sound suspiciously like a Norman settler to me. Get back where you came from, you flaming immigrant.

Apparently a combination of Norman and Danish.

---------- Post added at 14:34 ---------- Previous post was at 14:24 ----------

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees

OK, an open question, how do 'we' act?

What is it exactly that people want to be done?

Kick them right out, no appeals required. That includes those already here. Or at least lock them up(not in a holiday camp) as they are ILLEGAL. The ECHR and therefore the HRA don't impose a right to a fair hearing in deportation or extradition cases.

Eventually the message will get back to others and maybe they won't bother trying.

[mrmistoffelees]

Originally Posted by nomadking

Apparently a combination of Norman and Danish.

---------- Post added at 14:34 ---------- Previous post was at 14:24 ----------


Kick them right out, no appeals required. That includes those already here. Or at least lock them up(not in a holiday camp) as they are ILLEGAL. The ECHR and therefore the HRA don't impose a right to a fair hearing in deportation or extradition cases.

Eventually the message will get back to others and maybe they won't bother trying.

And those that are fleeing places such as Libya, Syria or other places with terrible human rights abuses we just boot them out, yes?

Lest we forget of course the cards we played in places such as Libya and Syria that led people to leave in the first place

[Osem]

We have to help genuine refugees as best we can and at the source of the problem as much as possible but we also have to accept that we can't save the all the world's needy and vulnerable. Neither can we carry on allowing hundreds of thousands of economic migrants to simply choose to come to the EU for a better life no matter how sorry we may feel for them.

More could and should be done to deal with the traffickers who're making vast sums exploiting these people and think nothing of sending them to their deaths once they've been paid. No doubt they paint a rather different picture of their intentions before they get the money and things go down hill rapidly thereafter.

I don't envy the authorities dealing with this problem - it's massive and the traffickers can often react to opportunities far quicker than they can. We're never going to be able to stop the flow entirely but we do need to adopt new measures which will both dissuade economic migrants and ensure they can be and are removed so that the message slowly gets out that there is no easy life to be had and we will not be 'blackmailed' or 'coerced' into admitting people just because they want to come here. That may well require changes in international law and to human rights legislation.

Like it or not, the Australians have to a large extent solved what was a growing problem there by being tough on migrants whether economic or refugees. That is sad, especially for the genuine refugees, but who can really say that they should just allow themselves to become the destination of choice for the region's countless millions of needy and desperate people?

Whatever people think we should do one thing is undeniable, we can't help everyone who needs it or would like a better life. Rather like a life boat saving people at sea, the only question is at what point are we forced to say no more...

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

Immigrants and benefits

Since illegals are not entitled to much in the way of benefits I wonder where all the stories abut them getting money, houses, etc are coming from? Can't just be the right wing press following an agenda?

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees

You have a history of making false claims regarding immigrants and immigration.

Again, what benefits do they claim?

I put it to you that you don't have a clue regarding the what an immigrant can and cannot claim for in this country. You're views instead are formed by such balanced publications as the Daily Mail

The moderators will do as they do as is their right and responsibility.

If you put your head above the parapet then don't go crying when someone takes a shot at it

If a person enters the UK illegally then hands himself or herself in and claims asylum, will he or she then get benefits during the long investigation process in to there claim and if they do then get benifits what do they get ????

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Sirius

If a person enters the UK illegally then hands himself or herself in and claims asylum, will he or she then get benefits during the long investigation process in to there claim and if they do then get benifits what do they get ????

It's all here including those who've been refused asylum:

https://www.gov.uk/asylum-support/what-youll-get

2. What you'll get

You can ask for somewhere to live, a cash allowance or both as an asylum seeker.

Housing

You’ll be given somewhere to live if you need it. This could be in a flat, house, hostel or bed and breakfast.

You can’t choose where you live. It’s unlikely you’ll get to live in London or south-east England.

Cash support

You’ll be able to collect money from a local post office each week. This will help you pay for things you need like food, clothing and toiletries.

The amount you get will depend on your situation.


Your situation

Weekly payment


Married couple or couple in civil partnership £72.52
Lone parent aged 18 or over £43.94
Single person aged 18 or over £36.95
Aged 16 to 18 £39.80
Aged under 16 £52.96

If you’ve been refused asylum

You’ll be given:
somewhere to live
£35.39 per person on a payment card for food, clothing and toiletries

You won’t be given:
the payment card if you don’t take the offer of somewhere to live
any money

Extra money for mothers and young children

You’ll get extra money to buy healthy food if you’re pregnant or a mother of a child under 3. The amount you get will depend on your situation.


Your situation

Extra payment per week


Pregnant mother £3
Baby under 1 year old £5
Child aged 1 to 3 £3

Maternity payment

You can apply for a one-off £300 maternity payment if your baby is due in 8 weeks or less, or if your baby is under 6 weeks old.

If you’ve been refused asylum

You can apply for a one-off £250 maternity payment if your baby is due in 8 weeks or less or if you baby is under 6 weeks old.

Applying for the maternity grant

You apply for the maternity grant in the same way whether you’re still an asylum seeker or you’ve been refused asylum.

You’ll need to request form MAT B1 from your doctor to apply for the payment. You can apply for the maternity payment at the same time you apply for asylum support.

If you get pregnant after you’ve applied for asylum support, you can apply to the support team that dealt with your application for asylum support.

Healthcare

You may get free National Health Service (NHS) healthcare, eg to see a doctor or get hospital treatment.

You’ll also get:
free prescriptions for medicine
free dental care for your teeth
free eyesight tests
help paying for glasses

Education

Your children must attend school if they are aged 5 to 17. All state schools are free and your children may be able to get free school meals.

You can't easily kick them out as they often have no papers so where do you move them do? Just pick a random country? Because that country wouldn't be too happy for you to be doing that.

Even if we secure Calais they'll move to just outside Calais and try to get on board earlier. The French can't lock down every piece of open land.

As Osem said we should target the traffickers. However the long-term answer is for the UK and others to work towards making the countries they're fleeing less horrid to live in.

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Osem

It's all here including those who've been refused asylum:

https://www.gov.uk/asylum-support/what-youll-get

If that is correct thats more than they would ever get where they have come from i would expect. No wonder they want to get into the free bank of UK

[dilli-theclaw]

Originally Posted by Osem

It's all here including those who've been refused asylum:

https://www.gov.uk/asylum-support/what-youll-get

I admit I am surprised at that.

MMMmmm.

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Damien

You can't easily kick them out as they often have no papers so where do you move them do? Just pick a random country? Because that country wouldn't be too happy for you to be doing that.

Even if we secure Calais they'll move to just outside Calais and try to get on board earlier. The French can't lock down every piece of open land.

As Osem said we should target the traffickers. However the long-term answer is for the UK and others to work towards making the countries they're fleeing less horrid to live in.

It would be a complete nightmare but maybe EVERY vehical should be searched on entry to a secure area of the port before the vehical boards the boat to the free bank of uk.

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by Osem

It's all here including those who've been refused asylum:

https://www.gov.uk/asylum-support/what-youll-get

So basically it's not much different to what a UK born person would get then?

somewhere to live. money. Dr. NHS.

Luxury to them.

You forgot the car.