Re: "The Welsh language
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Re: The Welsh language
I think the point he was making is that welsh people need to have english as well to interact outside of wales where very few if any people speak welsh. There are ignorant people everywhere amongst all languages it's not specific to any one group. While i think it's right that the government in wales does what it can to preserve the language and culture it shouldn't be forced on kids.
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Re: The Welsh language
Is there really a perception that in Wales there are children growing up only speaking Welsh and not knowing any English at all?
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Re: The Welsh language
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The reality is that kids are being educated in Welsh, but switch back to English as soon as they walk out the school gates because their mates speak English, their computer games are in English, the films they see and the music they want to listen to are in English. And after their schooldays, most work is in English. And no legislation is going to change that. Those that want the language to prosper should do so by winning the hearts and minds of people, not by making it law. But political groups don't want that, they want allegiance to their cause by playing on nationalistic sentiment. And we all know what happened when that sort of mass brainwashing happened in Europe, and why many refer to Welsh language activists as language nazis.... |
Re: The Welsh language
Many Welsh kids I knew were comfortable in both languages. Having the ability to use more than one language is a huge advantage. Kids in England learn English and use that, then at some point they learn a "second" or "third" in school but many do not actually get to use it.
So let's promote the use of Welsh in schools, keep the language living. Kids will still pick up and use English. |
Re: The Welsh language
I have no problem with people talking Welsh, even if i'm in a pub whilst they do it. I don't understand really having much of an issue there. In major cities you'll hear many different languages being spoken and so long as they're polite enough to speak English when specifically conversing with you then who cares how they talk to each other?
I don't understand schools teaching in Welsh though, the vast majority of the country speaks English so surely it's better to concentrate on that whilst having Welsh as an additional language you can learn in a specific class? I can understand schools teaching in another language if they're some sort of ex-pat school, i.e a French school in London whose pupils are largely intending to go back in France, but not for normal UK schooling.... |
Re: The Welsh language
But using Welsh is schools as opposed to simply teaching it enforces the language. You can learn it better and how it's used rather than enough to pass an exam or basic conversation. And Welsh is the language of Wales even if there are so many invaders that English is used more.
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Re: The Welsh language
I am from North Wales, I speak Welsh (self-taught) and I have lived in Cardiff and I now live in Merseyside. I also have a degree in Linguistics and I am a secondary English teacher in a Welsh school. The perception of Welsh in South East Wales is vastly different to the approach we have in the North - nonsensical discussions on the 'purpose' of the language don't really happen up here. Our languages merely co-exist and flow together, whether you're from a bilingual family or English-only.
However I'd like to clear a few things up on the Welsh education system:
By law, all pupils in Wales must study Welsh until age 16 through one of the channels mentioned above. Disapplying a pupil from GCSE Welsh is the same procedure as disapplication from GCSE English and is rarely done. Subsequently, those pupils who go to Welsh-medium schools have more GCSEs upon leaving secondary education. There have been many, many studies on the effects of bilinguialism, and the majority indicate (this is not specific to Welsh) bilingualism benefits language skills in both languages. Moreover, most of the world's population is multilingual, and much of the Anglophone world is in minority being monolingual. You will find that the majority of classes in Welsh-medium schools take a bilingual approach, especially with subject-specific jargon as we understand that the vast majority of higher education takes place in English ("sandwiching" is the educational term we use for bilingualism term introductions). I always teach my pupils that English has an absolutely shocking spelling system (pidgin Anglo-Saxon-Latin-French-British) but incredibly easy grammar; Welsh on the other hand has exceptionally easy spelling (like Spanish), but more difficult grammar. Incidentally, I have come across pupils who are dyslexic in one language but not in the other. Languages, their social histories, their evolution and their psychological bases absolutely fascinates me. If we were purely going on language 'usefulness', why are we not all learning Mandarin Chinese, Arabic or Hindi, which indeed have far greater number of speakers than German or French? English is a lingua-franca; it is an essential skill in a globalised world, but we must not be complacent and accept that English is not the only (nor the largest) lingua-franca. People who have absolutely no understanding of the Welsh (or any other minority) language, its history and culture provide little credibility in language-bashing rants I'm afraid. As for switching languages mid-conversation... this is called code-switching, which occurs in multilingual speakers of any language. It is an extremely complex (so much so it is hard to document and study) sociological-psychological phenomenon that is determined by a mixture of external factors. You will find most bilingual speakers speak to each person only in one language (the one in which they first met and talked). To change that is extremely 'odd', almost seeming taboo, and an almost unbreakable maxim. Codeswitching is so ingrained, bilingual speakers are often unaware they are doing it and it can occur in the strangest of moments. Where there are more people of one common language, people will of course accommodate to a shared code, but it is often difficult to sustain where two speakers share close and ingrained bonds in one language. |
Re: The Welsh language
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---------- Post added at 17:21 ---------- Previous post was at 17:15 ---------- Quote:
It causes practical problems and costs eg the police money on translation services that would be better spent elsewhere. As well as the practical problems posed, it's a question of good manners too. When I was a young man I intended to move to Holland. The first thing that I did to prepare was to take lessons in Dutch. A friend who was already there worked in a hotel and (quite rightly) was told to learn Dutch as a condition of keeping his job. They gave him a maximum of 6 months, which he complied with. ---------- Post added at 17:24 ---------- Previous post was at 17:21 ---------- Quote:
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Re: The Welsh language
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Re: The Welsh language
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Re: The Welsh language
Who are these english who get offended that welsh people speak welsh in wales I've been to wales a few times and never gave it a second thought when some spoke in welsh. There might be a few who get put out and i do mean a few but every nationality has that few they are called idiots and occur in all nationalities.
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Re: The Welsh language
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You'd be surprised how many foreigners speak no or very little English (especially when it's convenient to them). ---------- Post added at 20:15 ---------- Previous post was at 20:11 ---------- Quote:
* Which I would expect them to be able to do given that they learn English at school as a matter of course. |
Re: The Welsh language
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Re: The Welsh language
I live in the middle of England. I primarily speak English. I can usually greet and do pleasantries in another language and ask for things.
I find that other countries are far more eloquent in my home language than I am in theirs. I respect that. Bore da all :) |
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